The Extar EP45 in .45 ACP May Be the Best Budget Subgun You Can Buy

Extar EP45 sub gun

When it comes to famous submachine guns or iconic pistol caliber carbines, there are a few names that jump to the top of most people’s lists. But while the Mp5 and the KRISS Vector have style aplenty, it’s worth wondering if we can get similar performance at a fraction of the cost. The Extar EP45 offers .45 ACP firepower in a compact form. But does it punch above its budget price?

Extar EP45

Let’s cover the details as provided by Extar, then get into hands-on time.

Tech Specs:
  • Caliber: .45 ACP
  • Barrel Length: 6.5″
  • Barrel Thread: 5/8×24
  • Magazines: Glock 21 Compatible
  • Overall Length: 23.8″
  • Overall Height: 7.9″
  • Overall Width: 2″
  • Weight: 4.5lbs
  • Trigger: Single Stage
  • Charging Handle: Reciprocating
  • Brace: Extar Stabilizer or SBA3
  • Muzzle: Blast Director

So we’ve got what looks roughly like any other AR-based pistol caliber carbine. The Extar EP45 coming with a blast can is a little different, as is the left-hand reciprocating charging handle. The full-length, raised top rail is a change as well, breaking from the traditional norm of two rails meeting between the handguard and upper receiver.

Extar EP45

Extar advertises a proprietary Recoil Damping System, which consists of…well that’s not really described in any detail by Extar.

Polymer makes a strong showing in the Extar EP45, to include its fire control group. The quality of the trigger pull is surprisingly good despite what many would expect from a plastic trigger. And you can thank all of that polymer for the EP45’s scant 4.5-pound weight.

Pulling the EP45 apart is AR15-ish. The rear takedown pin is the same, but where the front takedown pin is a bit of a cup-and-wedge setup.

Extar EP45

Extar EP45

The bolt slides out the rear…or it would if the charging handle wasn’t sticking through the receiver.

Range Days

A light, small PCC is bound to draw some attention. One that shoots poorly though, will soon find itself in the dustbin of history. The Extar Ep45 has enough to distinguish itself on paper, but it’s at the range where we see what this collection of parts becomes.

In short, this gun is a dollar-per-smile monster. Shooting much like a combination of the MP5 and the Vector, the Extar EP45 handles well. Light weight can be an issue for guns chambered in heavy recoiling calibers, but the relatively mild .45 ACP round in such a platform is enjoyable and highly controllable.

Extar EP45

The EP45 has run through my remaining stock of HSM remanufactured FMJ rounds, and it’s now eating into my stock of more expensive hollow points. Frankly, I just like shooting this thing. I desperately need some increased capacity magazines, though. I think a 30-round stick mag or two is in my future.

I shot a few groups with the Extar EP45, offhand at 25 yards. They’re all around minute-of-fist, which is pretty much as expected. I don’t ever expect too much from a pistol caliber carbine, but I do expect them to be better than the handgun they’re taking the place of. In my mind that’s really the role of a PCC, rather than aiming at being a lower powered version of a rifle carbine.

More important is the basic shootability, a poorly defined concept that we the people at the range seem to grasp pretty well regardless. Using iron sights, standing, rapid fire, transitions…can I keep this gun on a mini E-type target at 25 yards?  Yes.  A 6-inch square? Uh huh. A 4-inch square? Not with rapid fire, but a slower rate of fire keeps every round a hit.

Extar EP45

What about the mini E-type at 50 yards? Easy peasy. A standard E-type target at 100 yards is where the rate of fire really slows down, but with a stable shooting base I was still able to get pretty consistent hits.

Extar EP45

Ergonomics

If you like most AR’s, you should like the Extar EP45. Besides the front-left charging handle (which reciprocates, watch out!) the fire controls and operations mimic those of an AR-15. The trigger is pretty impressive for a polymer setup.

My Extar EP45 came with a blade brace which I really like. It’s non-adjustable, but it’s fixed at a good length of pull and is comfortable to shoot.

Extar EP45

Bottom Line:

Truck gun. That’s absolutely where I see the Extar EP45 fitting in. It’s not expensive, it’s not high maintenance, but this is a gun that is plenty capable if you see a coyote (or any other problem critter) where it shouldn’t be.

The Extar EP45 runs $499.95 as shown…or with an optional $100 upgrade for the SBA3 brace. For that price, I’d say this is a very worthy gun for someone who wants KRISS Vector performance without the KRISS Vector price. This is a curious little gun, but one I’m really enjoying.

 

 

Jens “Rex Nanorum” Hammer @Rexnanorum 

 

 

 

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19 thoughts on “The Extar EP45 in .45 ACP May Be the Best Budget Subgun You Can Buy”

  1. Lot of potential especially if this setup can be made as modular and customizable as the AR it is loosely patterned off of. Been watching a few pcc/smg options for when I move and looking like at least one more to add to the list.

  2. I Haz A Question

    Looks nice, and I hope it sells well.

    Personally, I won’t buy a PCC in .45 ACP. If I ever get (or build) one, it would be in 10mm to allow for a higher round count in the mags. But that’s just me.

    1. I understand what you’re saying, but I’d like to present the opposing case, as I’ve done before: I’d only buy a PCC in .45. To me a 9mm makes no sense, why have a big gun for the weakest of service calibers? I want a big bullet that makes a big hole with a big smack, so that means 10mm and .45. And while I love 10mm, and carry 10mm, I want my PCC in .45 for one factor and only one factor: it’s quiet. You can run the hottest HST+P through a 16″ barrel and still be (just barely) subsonic. So a PCC with a silencer is quiet quiet quiet. You can’t get 10mm to be quiet (unless you dumb it down so much that it’s no better than .40, so what’s the point).

      Capacity is the question, and with the Extra taking Glock mags it’s pretty easy to find 30-round .45 magazines. They’re made by several different companies, and Kriss makes an extension for standard Glock 21 mags that brings them up to 30 rounds.

      So, my case for the .45 is quietness. If quietness isn’t a factor, then 10mm all the way, all day. But for use in a car/truck (eardrum-splitting close quarters) or in a room in a home, even a silenced 10mm will cause instant lifelong hearing damage. With the .45, you get a bigger bullet, same capacity (in a slightly longer mag) and you get to keep your eardrums.

      I love everything I’m reading about the Extar, and the price tag, but can’t finalize between it and the Ruger LC Carbine. I kind of want the extra 150 fps that the carbine will give, it seems to be the ultimate optimization of the .45 +P HST bringing it to just barely subsonic, so maximum smack, maximum diameter bullet, and minimum noise. If the Extar had a 16″ barrel option I’d already have it by now.

      Hey Jens “Rex Nanorum” Hammer, how about a comparison showdown/shootout between the EP45 and the LC Carbine?

      1. Can’t edit, so here’s a couple of corrections:
        Where I said I meant
        So a PCC with a silencer So a .45 PCC with a silencer
        and with the Extra and with the Extar

        plus one additional reason for the LC Carbine: it’s a carbine, so the silly on-again, off-again pistol brace rule doesn’t apply. I don’t trust the ATF or a future president to not reverse their ruling again, and again, and I don’t want to be in a defensive shooting with a braced pistol that just so happens to coincide with a current interpretation of the rule that makes me a felon. If the ATF does end up getting abolished, that would hopefully end this particular rollercoaster ride.

        1. I tend to reload so heavy for caliber subsonic loadings in any caliber are easy enough……well except for 357 Sig. With that said get what you are saying but I would more be looking for hilarious velocity in light for caliber ammo that can be quickly mag dumped and largely bypass soft armor with next to no recoil. Opposite end of the spectrum but similar in pushing the edge of capabilities for useful traits. With that said 45 is a great starting point for suppression options even if 9 can be done more quietly. And really want to see full auto in both your and my focus areas.

          1. “hilarious velocity in light for caliber ammo that can be quickly mag dumped and largely bypass soft armor with next to no recoil.”

            I agree that that is a tantalizing prospect, and Liberty ammo in the 10mm carbine hits dang near 2900 fps. Even so, I still invite you to consider .45. Liberty’s .45 hits around 2300 fps from the carbine. That’s within spitting distance of 5.56 AR-15 with a 16″ barrel shooting 77 grain ammo, which seems to average about 2500 fps.

            Not as hilarious as the 10mm, but it will still go through soft body armor easily.

          2. Never really looked at 45acp in the lighter loadings as much as super and Rowland but that is a sufficiently quick to create problems for the other side of the muzzle possibly even for lv 2 kevlar. Not sure about 3a but will make a not to try it if we ever get someone with a 45 carbine.

      2. Heavy 10mm can be quiet – not from a 16″ barrel, but if you’re suppressing (i.e. not afraid to be on The List) why use a 16″ barrel? Full-length rifle barrels make sense for rifle cartridges, but are counterproductive when you want less velocity. Also, a suppressor plus a full rifle barrel is as handy as a Brown Bess Musket, defeating the purpose of a handy PCC.

        1. Yes, that’s true, both the 200gr Gold Dot and HST stay subsonic from a 5″ barrel, they’re what I carry, but subsonic 10mm from a pistol vs subsonic .45+P from a carbine, the carbine is just better. Both go at 1100 fps-ish, but the .45 is substantially bigger in diameter and quite a bit heavier than the 10mm.

          But yeah, the.45 carbine barrel is going to be a lot longer than the pistol.

          The way I have been looking at it is, the carbine isn’t really any bigger than the pistol when you consider the pistol is held at arm’s length to fire, whereas the carbine is tucked into the body, so holding it close cancels out the longer barrel. Not necessarily in storming the beaches at Normandy, but in a home defense scenario it’s about the same muzzle distance from the body.

          Which is a great point for the Extar, you get the same tuck as a carbine but also the short barrel of the pistol.

          Is the Extar barrel changeable for a longer barrel? BBTI’s testing shows that a .45 usually reaches peak velocity at around 10-12″, so an Extar .45 with about an 11″ barrel might be the best of both worlds.

          1. 10mm goes up to 220 – a marginal difference in both weight and diameter from the .45. Suppressed, a carbine with that 5″ barrel will be nearly a foot shorter than the .45 (and tucked just as close to the body); it’s about 5″ shorter than the unsuppressed Extar. When muzzle energy is more important, it’s a mag swap away from beating the much clumsier 16″ gun.

          2. As for the length of the gun, yes a 10mm 5″ barrel Extar would be almost a foot shorter than a .45 16″ carbine. That’s a big deal and a very substantial consideration. And truthfully, the Extar .45 with a 10″ barrel would extract all the velocity you want from that .45 HST, so the last 6″ is just wasted. If Extar offered a long barrel option I do believe I would have bought it already, as it’s otherwise pretty much perfect and I’m very very interested in it.

            “10mm goes up to 220 – a marginal difference in both weight and diameter from the .45. ”

            Yes it does, but that is definitely not an apples-to-apples comparison to what I’ve been talking about. Yes, the 10mm has 220 loads available for it, but only in solids (hardcast, etc). No expanding hollowpoints exist in 10mm at 220 grain, and certainly not from recognized commercial suppliers like Federal HSTs or Speer Gold Dots.

            As for the size difference, it sounds minimal on paper but it’s not so minimal just looking at them. The .45 is 11.5mm, the 10 is (naturally) 10mm, and the 9mm is 9mm. So 10mm sits almost halfway between the .45 and the 9, and actually a tiny bit closer to the 9 than the .45. Which, of course, is why it has more rounds in a mag than a .45 does. It’s a big bullet, but I’d argue that the difference between the .45 and the 10 is definitely quite noticeable. Especially if we’re talking about a hardcast 10 vs an expanded .45; there the diameter difference will be drastic; you could literally fit four 10mm hardcasts in the hole that a single expanded .45 HST makes.

            Here’s an actual expanded HST .45 compared to a pixel-level accurate 10mm circle.
            https://ibb.co/N2P0ytsJ

            Now, expanding bullets tend to expand bigger the faster they travel, and that HST was shot at the typical 900 fps range for a .45. From a carbine I’d expect another 150 fps, so it may expand even bigger.

            I’m not knocking the 10mm. I love the 10mm. Look at my username. I carry the 10mm daily, loaded with HSTs, and am supremely confident in it. I’m just saying that if you’re limited to subsonic velocities (such as I would like a home defense gun to be), .45 beats 10mm. As a defensive load, it’s 15% heavier and has a larger starting diameter which will lead to a larger expanded bullet diameter.

            In any case other than a suppressed home defense gun, I would always take 10mm over .45. Always. I’m just saying that in this one specific use (suppressed) at the same velocity, the .45 produces bigger holes and delivers more energy on the target at subsonic velocity. Energy for 230 grains at 1100 fps = 618 ft/lbs; for a 200 grain 10mm at 1100 fps it’s 537. Not a drastic difference, but there is a difference to be had, and when defending my home I want that difference.

            Truthfully, if I could just find a carbine conversion kit for my 10mm 5″ XDM I’d just get that instead of a whole new gun. But so far I can’t find one, the MCK doesn’t work with an XD with a threaded barrel and I haven’t found a serious contender from anyone else yet.

          3. You raise some good points (e.g. I honestly hadn’t noticed the lack of 220 10mm JHPs because, like SAFE, I favor the light/fast end). I wouldn’t necessarily say “if you’re limited to subsonic velocities .45 beats 10mm,” though. Moving around a house constantly requires the “support hand” to do everything but support, and IMHO a 42″ suppressed full-length rifle is hopeless as a “hand and a half” gun. From a PDW barrel, 10mm drives those 200gr JHPs right up to the threshold of subsonic, getting better KE than 850fps .45.

            I can never find exactly what I want either, so I make it. I think my next project may be a 9mm fixed-barrel Witness upper for suppressed use.

          4. There comes a point where one has to say fuck it bring back 50gi and/or go for the dd stamp and wildcat something bigger when subsonic ammo is the major feature and min maxing gets involved.

          5. SAFE,
            I haven’t looked into it much, but has anyone been doing anything with heavier bullets in Rowland?

          6. Overwhelmingly I tend to see stuff too out around 250g with…… questionable load data. I am pretty sure the 300 range would be possible given length of projectile but with all of the available pistols we have being Glock based for Rowland there is a reluctance to try anything in cast lead even with the poly coat. If I end up going the USP route anytime soon I will let you know what I figure out as I am more focused on 357 Sig/mag, 475 linebaugh, 10mm and 44 mag experimentation in about that order currently.

        2. Given my current location in NY the only NFA I can potentially get would be destructive devices and only non-explosive. With that said given the option short barreled suppressed would be my starting point for anything pistol caliber and fun.

  3. The AR with its skinny BCG has its hands full as a 9mm blowback, and is marginal at best as a .45. Are my eyes correct, that Extar has used a larger-diameter receiver and buffer tube for this .45?

    P.S. Thanks for concisely summing up the case for PDWs.

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